Thread: X-10 or P7100... With a Catch

I haven't looked at the comparometer yet, but I'd guesstimate that the X10 would not be significantly better than other enthusiast level P&S cameras in terms of pixel level sharpness and being noise-free. After all, the X10 is a P&S. While its sensor is a bit bigger than the standard P&S, it's not that much bigger.

What separates the X10 from other cameras (other than styling) is the fast lens in a fairly usable focal length. I believe the XZ1 is the only P&S out there with a faster and equally flexible/usable focal length. But to me, I prefer the ergonomics and customizability of the X10 over the XZ1. I never bonded with the XZ1, and the auto iSO was really annoying. In any event, with the X10 (and XZ1), you can get away with shooting at lower ISO whereas you'd need to bump it up with the 230 and the 7100 or G12.

As for the EXR, IMO, the EXR helps more with dynamic range than with noise reduction. My thought is that the reduction in noise levels that I see on EXR photos is more of a result from downsampling a 12 mp photo to a 6 mp photo, rather than the EXR technology itself. BUT, the "pro low light" mode does work wonders in noise reduction while retaining excellent details. So that's a definite big PLUS for the X10.

For your question about having to go to EXR at high ISO, that is not the case. EXR has its own mode dial selection. And according to some folks, EXR is also triggered if one uses 6 mp files in any of the PASM modes and sets the DR (dynamic range) option to "auto". I am thinking that the comparometer likely used full sized 12 mp files, which then does not have the benefit of EXR's noise reduction scheme. All EXR files are 6 mp's, with the exception of EXR "HR", which is for high resolution at 12 mp, and which pretty much means that there is no EXR being used. Thumbs up to marketing scheme there!

Originally Posted by demiro

Biro, I'll give you the obvious answer "You really have to try them both". I've never used the Nikon, but have owned the somewhat similar Canon G11, and am a current X10 user. I know the G11 can take great shots, but I really didn't like the camera much at all. At the end of the day it just felt like a P&S camera with a bunch of nice external controls. The X10 feels like a different beast altogether to me.

It is tough to justify the difference, but a cheaper camera that doesn't really compel you to use it is hardly a bargain in my book. That may be a load of crap, but it's how I justify a $600 P&S! ;)

Just jumping in here to say welcome, demiro! I'm big on enjoying a camera enough to use it, too. Please stop by our Welcomes and Introductions forum when you can!

Now back to our regularly scheduled, evolving discussion.

Originally Posted by Armanius

For your question about having to go to EXR at high ISO, that is not the case. EXR has its own mode dial selection. And according to some folks, EXR is also triggered if one uses 6 mp files in any of the PASM modes and sets the DR (dynamic range) option to "auto". I am thinking that the comparometer likely used full sized 12 mp files, which then does not have the benefit of EXR's noise reduction scheme. All EXR files are 6 mp's, with the exception of EXR "HR", which is for high resolution at 12 mp, and which pretty much means that there is no EXR being used. Thumbs up to marketing scheme there!

Yes, this is what I'm thinking... because the test shots show no real advantage over the other cameras while most people who use the X-10 in the real world say it offers high ISO performance closer to micro four-thirds cameras than others with sensors of about the same size. I may have to think about this a bit more.

Also, Aramius, any issues with the white "globes" from your X-10?

Biro, one other thought from me, relative to the SX230 (which I also own). There is no comparison in IQ between it and the X10. I like the 230, and in good light with few challenges it will produce very nice images. The X10 will go way beyond that in terms of low light though, and I don't think you have to go all that low to bump in to the limitations of the 230.