Leica Leica M-E | First Test Drive

Duane Pandorf

Duane Pandorf

Top Veteran
Location
Western NC
Got out today even though it looked like it would drizzle or rain at any time but the dog needed a walk. Of course these are some of the same shots I've taken in the past with GXR.

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Have to admit to missing Leica "M's", used them when I worked as a PJ years ago and they never let me down - small, silent, solid & reliable!

Invested in M8.2 when I went totally digital, superb build but IQ above 800 was dissapointing and as you need to purchase expensive eyepiece correction lenses (now wear reading glasses) rather than built in dioptre control, plus issues with "coffee stain syndrome" twice on saphire LCD as well as some shutter issues, I decided to part company with it and declined the offer of an upgrade to M9 as I felt the sensor did not justify the price increase for me personally coupled with awful dust issues, so went another route.

There is no doubting the quality of lenses but I do think Leica have ramped their pricing structures up beyond justification for the quality of images they offer in comparison to the competition and with no disrespect intended, they have now become more of a object of desire based on past reputation / myth than a cost effective tool and this is borne out by the number of pros/jobbing photographers who have switched to DSLR's / other brands.

I would love to see Leica produce an updated "M" that retains exisitng body style but like the special edition version they had out a year ago had electonic projected lines in the viewfinder rather than exisitng ones, a Sony sensor would also make sense rather than current obscure ones and a price point that makes it a more accessible product to all - I do not expect we will see an AF option and not sure that holds with the ethos of "M", built in dioptre control would be nice but that is me being selfish.

I do suspect that the "Young guns & big boys" are chipping away consistantly at leica's market share and the Fuji X100 / XPro-1 has definately had an impact (heard that from 2 Leica retailers I know and have to admit to now owning X100 that gives me better IQ by far than my last M8.2 and offers many options Leica should offer).

Despite my ramblings, I hope you enjoy your camera and that it proves the right tool for you.

Good luck,
Ian
 
Duane ...... great shots ....... and subjects

a Leica is a Leica ....... expensive but it's a Leica ........ nothing else really like it ...... quality costs money

must get my "coffee stained" M8 out .......... in fact the above shots have inspired me to do that!!!
 
Not Leica bashing at all but home truths based on my experiences of owning Leica Digitals following years of using M analogues!

As I stated, I used leica "M4-P's / M6's" when working as a PJ and they were/are superb analogue machines but for me personally the M Digitals have not and do not live up to my expectations and the price point has now become ridiculous as well as the technology not having moved ahead.

There are other cameras out there that produce equivalent quality at a more affordable/realistic price point and I know they are not assembled by hand in Solms, but they are well made and offer many advantages - the end justifies the means and that is what I look for in a camera now that my photography is no longer a living but is a hobby.

Please do not perceive that every post stating some negatives based on experience is "Leica bashing" it is not and comments like that only serve to create division and inflame those posting.
 
Thanks all for your wonderful comments. Just a couple months ago I swore I didn't need nor want a FF frame camera. The only Leica body I've had in my hands was the M9 for a very short amount of time in a store in Barcelona this past summer. Thought it was too big compared to my Ricoh GXR.

But now that I made the decision, I knew full well the other options available out there as they are regularly discussed here and other forums.

Yes the high ISO sucks compared to say the Xpro and many others. However, it came down to a couple major items I realized I wanted.

1. A company with a long history of maintaining high standards.
2. Durability
3. And most important, simplicity.

Its refreshing to only have a few Menu items to have to learn. One knob on the top to control shutter speed. (So far mine is set to "A" but I have experimented with shooting manual and like how easy that is) The dial knob on back is set to control exposure comp. I what I really like is the shutter itself. I have it set to Soft but may change that when my Tim Isaac Beep arrives. (Already installed his Thumbs Up)
 
Don't know why, but no 3 is appealing, to me. Perhaps the calming nature of the mist and the blur. Whatever it is, I like it.

Gordon
 
Iansky said:
Not Leica bashing at all but home truths based on my experiences of owning Leica Digitals following years of using M analogues!

As I stated, I used leica "M4-P's / M6's" when working as a PJ and they were/are superb analogue machines but for me personally the M Digitals have not and do not live up to my expectations and the price point has now become ridiculous as well as the technology not having moved ahead.

There are other cameras out there that produce equivalent quality at a more affordable/realistic price point and I know they are not assembled by hand in Solms, but they are well made and offer many advantages - the end justifies the means and that is what I look for in a camera now that my photography is no longer a living but is a hobby.

Please do not perceive that every post stating some negatives based on experience is "Leica bashing" it is not and comments like that only serve to create division and inflame those posting.
Click to expand...

You're not going to hurt my feelings Iansky. I knew what I was getting into when I bought the M-E. Its waaaaay from perfect in many ways. Doesn't focus inside of .7 meters. No frame lines for anything wider than 28mm. Long lenses can be a challenge, etc etc etc.

I have an iPhone for video, GRDIII for macro or iPhone.
 
Iansky said:
Have to admit to missing Leica "M's", used them when I worked as a PJ years ago and they never let me down - small, silent, solid & reliable!

Invested in M8.2 when I went totally digital, superb build but IQ above 800 was dissapointing and as you need to purchase expensive eyepiece correction lenses (now wear reading glasses) rather than built in dioptre control, plus issues with "coffee stain syndrome" twice on saphire LCD as well as some shutter issues, I decided to part company with it and declined the offer of an upgrade to M9 as I felt the sensor did not justify the price increase for me personally coupled with awful dust issues, so went another route.

There is no doubting the quality of lenses but I do think Leica have ramped their pricing structures up beyond justification for the quality of images they offer in comparison to the competition and with no disrespect intended, they have now become more of a object of desire based on past reputation / myth than a cost effective tool and this is borne out by the number of pros/jobbing photographers who have switched to DSLR's / other brands.

I would love to see Leica produce an updated "M" that retains exisitng body style but like the special edition version they had out a year ago had electonic projected lines in the viewfinder rather than exisitng ones, a Sony sensor would also make sense rather than current obscure ones and a price point that makes it a more accessible product to all - I do not expect we will see an AF option and not sure that holds with the ethos of "M", built in dioptre control would be nice but that is me being selfish.

I do suspect that the "Young guns & big boys" are chipping away consistantly at leica's market share and the Fuji X100 / XPro-1 has definately had an impact (heard that from 2 Leica retailers I know and have to admit to now owning X100 that gives me better IQ by far than my last M8.2 and offers many options Leica should offer).

Despite my ramblings, I hope you enjoy your camera and that it proves the right tool for you.

Good luck,
Ian
Click to expand...

Leica, like any other company, is a business. And a business that nearly went under. And then comes the highly flawed M9. Bashed wildy by the photographic press except for a few select fanboys and technically inferior to almost every similarly priced camera on the market at its release.

And yet it sold five times Leica's original production estimate. It was in short supply for a full year after release and demand for it and the lenses went through the roof. So the price of the body stayed high and the price of lenses increased to match the second hand market. Supply and demand.

If Leica had put a Sony/Canon sensor in the M9 they would be broke today. A highly priced, handmade and relatively archaec camera that produced images exactly the same as cameras that are cheaper or easier to use is silly. Leica took a highly successful gamble. The camera obviously didn't suit you (well the M8. You never had any real time with the M9) but it said something to 50,000 others.

Lots of cameras have many more functios/features performance than any M. The M has simplicity and soul. To some that counts for more than autofocus or noise free performance.

Gordon
 
There's no need to argue for or against Leica. It is simply the only current digital camera in its class - a true rangefinder with an optical viewfinder. That, plus Leica has always been premium. It simply is what it is.

One point though, not strictly about Leica (I had a Zeiss Ikon in the past)... even with all of the focus peaking technology available today I still find the rangefinder and OVF easier to use. More difficult as my eyes age, but still easier and in most cases more enjoyable.
 
BillN said:
Duane ...... great shots ....... and subjects

a Leica is a Leica ....... expensive but it's a Leica ........ nothing else really like it ...... quality costs money

must get my "coffee stained" M8 out .......... in fact the above shots have inspired me to do that!!!
Click to expand...

Thanks Bill, hope all is well your way! Happy New Year to you!
 
I am not knocking Leica and as can be read in my previous posts have owned and used them for years in a professional capacity, yes they are a thing of beauty and a tactile masterpiece that needs the user to think and work rather than "point & shoot", for that they are second to none and I still stand by that.
My dissatisfaction was based on the changes from analogue to digital and the associated issues Leica had/has relating to this - I agree they very nearly lost it and went under and I am happy to see their survival, alas, their cameras are still desperately expensive and out of the reach of many and require an informed decision/strong desire to invest in them and once purchased they do have that "Leica thing" that makes the user smile with the weight,feel,tactile control,manual focussing all great assets (dioptre control lenses are very expensive though) and things that make Leica great.
My personal experiences based on my ownership of the M8.2 and using an M9 (positives above not included) were not as rewarding due to the issues I had that required the camera going back to Solms twice and fast heading for a third trip back, coupled with the poor IQ above 800 (I did not find the M9 to be dramatically different above 800) were things that did not work for me personally and led me to parting company with the kits while it still had residual value.
I would love to see Leica develop (no pun intended) and grow and the continuing production of the "M" series is an essential part of that but I do feel in their efforts to be different, they have gone with obscure sensor makers rather than established proven manufacturers used by the likes of Nikon etc.
I do still feel they need to look at their pricing as since the advent of the M Digitals, each new/upgraded model has had a price point £1000.00 higher than the previous version on average and this in turn limits access to those who are more well healed than others.
My comments are not and have not in any way been shared with intent at "Leica bashing as intimated in a previous post" but rather a quick synopsis of my personal experiences with M Digitals following years of M Analogue use, purchase of any camera is a personal choice and should be based on personal needs/desires/resources not on what others say write.
I do wish you well with your Leica and hope it gives you many years of great photography you will be happy with.
 

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