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Brian Jones, the Rolling Stones and picking at the musical bones

Discussion in 'The Watering Hole' started by Luke, Aug 21, 2015.

  1. Luke

    Luke Super Moderator

    Nov 11, 2011
    Milwaukee, WI USA
    Luke
    Coming from a guy who thinks there are no great stones records after the 60s, I can only imagine the news of Brian Jones death (at the shop, we like to say, no Jones, no Stones...... it's just not the same group)

    And me and Parmesan don't get along either. I call it dirty feet cheese....that's what is smells like to me. Unless you're in a great Italian deli, and they've got the GOOD stuff....fresh off the boat (and freshly grated)...... and even then, I'd rather not.
     
  2. rbelyell

    rbelyell SC Top Veteran

    819
    May 14, 2013
    NY Mtns
    no luke, say it aint so! sticky fingers?! exile??!! some freaking girls???!!! i literally have over 500 stones bootleg records, plus gobs of video. favorite group ever, saw 'em a whole bunch o' times. love brian jones, but almost nobody plays guitar like mick taylor. saw him live a couple times at the bottom line in the village after his solo album, i think called 'leather jacket' came out. he followed clapton, beck & page with mayall's bluesbreakers. imo, third best white slide player. who would be your top two?
     
  3. Luke

    Luke Super Moderator

    Nov 11, 2011
    Milwaukee, WI USA
    Luke
    Tony, you got me and Ray mixed up. Don't worry, I'm sure he's on your side and prefers the 70s Stones to the 60s, too. But your post did tune me into something I had never considered. Maybe it's that guys who are into guitar players just prefer the 70s stuff and those who prefer a well-crafted 2:30 song prefer the 60s stuff.

    btw, I don't want to derail the thread into a Stones conversation. But if you guys want to continue to discuss the relative merits of RS records, I can always break if off into a thread of it's own.
     
  4. rbelyell

    rbelyell SC Top Veteran

    819
    May 14, 2013
    NY Mtns
    oh gosh luke, i'm so sorry! we've been out driving all day and my mind musta been mucked up a bit.

    i love love love the 60s r&b stones, and i think beggars banquet is one of the 'comeback albums' of all time (but so is some girls!). and i think the 60s live stuff was great for its absolute innocence and unbridled frenzy. but yeah, at the end of the day i'm a guitar guy and a performance guy. the '69, '72 and '75 tours are the pinnacle for me, and exile is a 'desert island disc'.

    and yeah, i'd go a moonlight mile for a stones thread!

    ps, the answer to the 'slide guitar' question is duane allman and johnny winter!:biggrin::drinks:
     
  5. Luke

    Luke Super Moderator

    Nov 11, 2011
    Milwaukee, WI USA
    Luke
    That also explains your 500 bootlegs. You're a "performance" guy. You love the excitement of "live". I'm a "recording" guy. Live performances (to me) are like raw image files. They need to be worked over the producer, they need edits, overdubs, sweetening....maybe even dodging and burning :biggrin:.

    To me they are all flawed....if I'm THERE....I feel slightly different. But I GENERALLY have little use for a live recording.

    No one is right here, obviously. It's just one's personal preference. And certainly there are folks who love it both ways. But I think it's interesting that most people seem to have a preference of live music vs. records.
     
  6. rbelyell

    rbelyell SC Top Veteran

    819
    May 14, 2013
    NY Mtns
    yeah, i think thats true. even my studio album preference is for a 'live' sound most of the time, like exile. sounds like they recorded it in a garage. probably why i love the allman brothers, and 'layla' album and punk and johnny cash. etc etc etc.

    on the other hand, had sgt pepper on in the car today--ultimate studio album, i never tire of it. and a fair number of my 'boots' are alternate studio recordings, tryouts for guitar players like jeff beck, etc. i guess i'm just a mass of contradictions!:coco:
     
    Last edited: Aug 21, 2015
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Ray Sachs

    Ray Sachs SC Legend

    Sep 21, 2010
    Not too far from Philly
    you should be able to figure it out...
    Hey, I like '60s Stones as much as the next guy. Through the Past Darkly was one of the first three albums I ever bought when I was 9 years old, along with Cream's Greatest Hits and Iron Butterfly Heavy - two out of three ain't bad! But as much as I love the early/mid-60's stuff, to me '68 through '72 was the best they ever were - Beggars Banquet through Exile to be precise. I loved Brian Jones, but there was something about the more defined division of labor between Keith and Mick Taylor that just worked on more levels for me. And plus, they were just more mature as songwriters and musicians too. Exile is my desert island record for sure. And then '78-'81 was pretty good too, in a completely different style. Some Girls and Tattoo You were damn good albums - not '60s or early '70s great, but I still pull 'em out from time to time.

    But hey, you can't trust me - I always liked the Dead best with one drummer from '72-74 too. I'm guessing Luke hates all eras of the Dead equally... And unlike Luke I love live albums. Lot's of them sucked, but some of them are wonderful. I'll take the Allman Bros at Fillmore East (and the live part of Eat A Peach) over ANY of their studio stuff. And the best Dead never made it into formal releases. I'm really into improvisation, warts and all, and it just doesn't happen the same way in the studio.

    Tony, I last saw Dr John open for the Nevilles within the past five year I think, although I'm not sure exactly when. I'd seen both of them when they were simply amazing and by this last show, they were working HARD just to make ANYthing happen. The Doc was trying to move what little he had to between instruments with the help of a cane. And Aaron didn't have those beautiful highs anymore - he could fake a few of them, but 10-20 years before that he was one of the wonders of the world, and he was having to work too hard just to get through the show the last time. Glad they were still playing, but I honestly would have been happier to remember them in their primes. I think Keith Richards turned me onto the Nevilles back in about '80 or 81 in an interview. I saw them a few times from then until that last show...

    -Ray
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Luke

    Luke Super Moderator

    Nov 11, 2011
    Milwaukee, WI USA
    Luke
    Actually, I like several of their albums. It took me awhile to appreciate them. But again, it's the studio albums. They have some great tunes. The endless jams, I'll save for you. :drinks:
     
  9. rbelyell

    rbelyell SC Top Veteran

    819
    May 14, 2013
    NY Mtns
    luke do you mean 'keef, the human riff'? the only guy to play a decade unconcious? that guy turned you on to the nevilles? he had some pretty eclectic tastes for his day. i miss that keef. its another goodbye to another good friend. ):

    i first saw the nevilles by accident at tipitinas in new orleans in the '80s. saw steve riley there too, playing for a local dance night. one of the most fun nights i ever had. ranks up there with when i saw debbie harry singing jazz standards in a black evening dress somewhere in soho ny. or johnny thunders last show in ny, a midnight acoustic set at a loft near 14th street. better to be lucky than good, no? dont start me reminiscin'...wish i had a camera with me for any of those.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2015
  10. bilzmale

    bilzmale Super Moderator Emeritus

    Jul 17, 2010
    Perth, Western Australia
    Bill Shinnick
    "Crossfire Hurricane" was on TV this week - took me back to when our little garage band was covering new Stones singles and EPs. Loved them plus the Yardbirds and the Animals. Still my favourite musical era.
     
  11. Luke

    Luke Super Moderator

    Nov 11, 2011
    Milwaukee, WI USA
    Luke
    It was a great time. 50-some years later and we're still discovering some amazing little garage bands like yours, Bill. So I gotta ask..... any photos of recordings.
     
  12. Ray Sachs

    Ray Sachs SC Legend

    Sep 21, 2010
    Not too far from Philly
    you should be able to figure it out...
    It's not the endless jams I liked, it was the transcendent ones, which didn't happen every time, but happened often enough to keep coming back. And occasionally the great ones and the endless ones coincided. They never liked their studio albums with one or two exceptions - they thought of them as necessary evils. But I agree with you that they have a lot of great tunes, something that separates them from a lot of otherwise very good "jam bands".

    -Ray
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2015
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Ray Sachs

    Ray Sachs SC Legend

    Sep 21, 2010
    Not too far from Philly
    you should be able to figure it out...
    I'll never forget when someone first showed me the open G tuning that Keith used for most of his great riffs. Those riffs were totally mysterious to me until I learned that tuning, and suddenly they were all the easiest thing you'd ever want to play. I even came up with a few back in the day. The only problem was that everything you played sounded like Keith but not as good. It was tough to do anything else with that unless you were playing slide.

    -Ray
     
  14. bluzcity

    bluzcity SC Veteran

    310
    Jul 30, 2013
    Memphis, TN
    Brent
    ps, the answer to the 'slide guitar' question is duane allman and johnny winter!:biggrin::drinks:[/QUOTE]

    Don't forget Warren Haynes!
     
  15. rbelyell

    rbelyell SC Top Veteran

    819
    May 14, 2013
    NY Mtns
    nice call.
     
  16. dalethorn

    dalethorn Guest

    The 1964 stereo recordings such as I can't be Satisfied, Confessin' the Blues, 2120 South Michigan Avenue - those had the best sound quality they ever did. Altamont was the capstone to their career - many people wring their hands, gnash their teeth, and cry crocodile tears over that one, but the event flowed from the theme like a gift from Satan himself.

    But in terms of Rock-n-Roll, I find that She's So Cold is one of the best by any group - up there with Hot Legs, Radio Free Europe, Aqualung, etc. Satisfaction was often referenced as the greatest of rock tunes before the era of Stairway To Heaven, Free Bird, Won't Get Fooled Again etc., but in truth, Satisfaction had an unusual appeal in that it was very popular with African Americans - one such friend of mine described it as "the downbeat", and he was not otherwise a fan of the Stones.
     
  17. Lawrence A.

    Lawrence A. SC All-Pro

    Nov 8, 2012
    New Mexico
    Larry
    I know nothing about the Stones, but ALL the best cheeses stink -- a really good Stilton should be creamy, ripe, and stinky. Sorry guys. If it doesn't stink, it must be Velveeta.

    And now -- damn it! - I really want some Stilton and a good pear.