Yeats
All-Pro
- Location
- New Jersey, USA
- Name
- Chris
I don't mean "disposable" in the sense that it feels cheap - notice in my statement I spoke in terms of IQ, not construction.
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I don't mean "disposable" in the sense that it feels cheap - notice in my statement I spoke in terms of IQ, not construction.
Duane Pandorf
Top Veteran
- Location
- Western NC
I don't mean "disposable" in the sense that it feels cheap - notice in my statement I spoke in terms of IQ, not construction.
I guess I don't understand the analogy of a digital camera's image quality (IQ) "feeling" disposable as compared to a film camera. Is it because newer sensors are being developed as compared to film seeming to not have advanced in a like manner?
Yeats
All-Pro
- Location
- New Jersey, USA
- Name
- Chris
Something like that... you could take an SLR from 1975 and one from 1985, and as long as you use the same film and comparable lens, the output quality will be generally the same. But if you take a DSLR from 2003 and compare it to one from 2013, the one from 2013 will have better IQ, if using a similar lens, etc. I'd imagine for people who have a history of investing in a camera for long-term usage - measured in decades - digital feels "disposable", in the way that in my family we had an Olympia typewriter for a quarter-century, but who uses a computer for so long? Computers are more "disposable".
Edit: thankfully, really good lenses don't seem to follow this path so much!
- Location
- Milwaukee, WI USA
- Name
- Luke
I understand Yeats point. But I think we may be reaching a point where all that is changing. Once all cameras have sensors that have 13 EV of dynaimc range and have relatively clean ISO6400, then digital bodies IQ differences will stop changing every 6 months or every year. We've been gaining a half stop or a stop every cycle and we are just about to the point where cameras are seeing in the dark and highly detailed stuff can be pulled out of pitch black areas.
So then it will be the user experience that will sell the camera. Assuming nothing else changes, this all works to Leica's advantage because they always lag a generation behind in the "tech" stuff. The optics never really change (except the computer modeling means the other lens makers have closed the gap!) but Leica bodies always have last years LCD screens and the sensors have always been a couple stops behind the current generation. They've gotten by on ergonomics, the rangefinder experience and their good name (and build quality). Eventually all camera will max out IQ....there is a limit, and then the user experience will trump all.
I think I'm yammering....must be time for bed.
So then it will be the user experience that will sell the camera. Assuming nothing else changes, this all works to Leica's advantage because they always lag a generation behind in the "tech" stuff. The optics never really change (except the computer modeling means the other lens makers have closed the gap!) but Leica bodies always have last years LCD screens and the sensors have always been a couple stops behind the current generation. They've gotten by on ergonomics, the rangefinder experience and their good name (and build quality). Eventually all camera will max out IQ....there is a limit, and then the user experience will trump all.
I think I'm yammering....must be time for bed.
Gary
All-Pro
- Location
- Southern California
- Name
- Gary Ayala
+1
john m flores
All-Pro
I can't even afford the rumor.
If only it were so simple ...
When I had an Olympus E300 I used to think 8MP was plenty for everything ... nah, first it was megapixels, then dynamic range, then video performance, lens speed and thanks to the intrusion of cell phones, now the signs are the marketing (i.e. design) shift is going to GPS, wifi, social connectedness and app-ability (blah).
At least the 3D phase seems to be dying quietly in a dark corner ...
Of course y'all talking about Leica, sorry I yammering about the non-Leica, and the one of the things I respect about the red badge company is that they have stuck to their guns that they are a camera manufacturer
When I had an Olympus E300 I used to think 8MP was plenty for everything ... nah, first it was megapixels, then dynamic range, then video performance, lens speed and thanks to the intrusion of cell phones, now the signs are the marketing (i.e. design) shift is going to GPS, wifi, social connectedness and app-ability (blah).
At least the 3D phase seems to be dying quietly in a dark corner ...
Of course y'all talking about Leica, sorry I yammering about the non-Leica, and the one of the things I respect about the red badge company is that they have stuck to their guns that they are a camera manufacturer
greyelm
All-Pro
- Location
- London, England
Sneak preview. It comes pre-brassed
Armanius
Bring Jack back!
- Location
- Houston, Texas
- Name
- Jack
- Location
- Melbourne, Australia
ah I didn't know that. I've seen APS-C referred to as 1.6 to 1.5 in the filmmaking forums. That's roughly the size of super35mm film.
Lightmancer
Legend
- Location
- Sunny Frimley
- Name
- Bill Palmer
The box is opened a little bit more:
Leica Camera AG - Home
Both leicarumors and mirrorlessrumors are now reporting an apsc sensor with fixed zoom lens. It is too bad if they don't have a m-mount camera. One more week to the announcement...
Leica Camera AG - Home
Both leicarumors and mirrorlessrumors are now reporting an apsc sensor with fixed zoom lens. It is too bad if they don't have a m-mount camera. One more week to the announcement...
Gubrz
O.* Gonzo's & Bentley's Dad
- Location
- Austin, TX
- Name
- Eliot
Armanius
Bring Jack back!
- Location
- Houston, Texas
- Name
- Jack
If it's something along the lines of 24-70mm (EFL) f2-3.5 ...
Luckypenguin
Hall of Famer
- Location
- Brisbane, Australia
- Name
- Nic
I think that would have been the old Sony R1. Currently the Canon G1X almost fits that description (and is much smaller in the body and lens than the old Sony) but the sensor has been cut down slightly from full APS-C size.
The successor to the Digilux II? This would be quite something. The Digilux II was the digital camera with the best zoom and manual controls ever. However, my money is still on a mft sensor.
Duane Pandorf
Top Veteran
- Location
- Western NC
There's no way the camera will be a cropped sensor with fixed lens and sell for around $4,000. This camera is to be positioned between their fixed lens camera (X2) and the new M240.
Duane Pandorf
Top Veteran
- Location
- Western NC
I like Thorsten Overgaard's opinion on what the mini M will be. (I've cut and pasted this from one of his Facebook posts earlier today)
"Leica Mini-M: The most logical would be a CMOS-based camera that has a digital viewfinder and take M lenses, perhaps a Jonathan Ive/Leica M9 Titanium inspired design to sex it up a bit (omitting the expensive viewfinder and base it on CMOS will make it less expensive than a Leica ME; as would rethinking the whole body from mechanical design to electronical design. Maybe one does not need a review screen on the back)"
"Leica Mini-M: The most logical would be a CMOS-based camera that has a digital viewfinder and take M lenses, perhaps a Jonathan Ive/Leica M9 Titanium inspired design to sex it up a bit (omitting the expensive viewfinder and base it on CMOS will make it less expensive than a Leica ME; as would rethinking the whole body from mechanical design to electronical design. Maybe one does not need a review screen on the back)"
