Nex-7

Discussion in 'Open Gear Talk' started by olli, Apr 22, 2011.

  1. olli

    olli Super Moderator Emeritus

    Sep 28, 2010
    Metro Manila
    olli
    I'm afraid I don't have an exclusive announcement for you here, though I wish I did. The 'NEX-7' is of course only one of a number of eagerly anticipated new products from Sony. We are also waiting on the 'A77' and the Carl Zeiss 24mm E-mount lens.

    At least we have seen some mock ups of the 'A77' and the planned E-Mount lenses but as yet nothing official on the next NEX. Over at SonyAlpha Rumors (SAR), there have been a string of posts speculating on the specifications of the 'NEX-7', conveniently summarised in one recent posting.

    For a camera rumoured to be released only three months from now the information is decidedly thin. Will it be bigger than the current models? Will it have a built in electronic viewfinder? It will, it seems, have more knobs, dials and buttons - though whether that is a good thing might be debatable. It will have a higher build quality, though at a rumoured $1300 it had better have.

    The most interesting - and most problematic - rumour is that it will have a 24MP sensor, shared with the new 'A77'. Of course there will be concerns over the implications for image quality of packing that many pixels onto an APS-C sized sensor. Though Sony seem to have overcome their earlier weakness in this regard with the excellent 16 MP sensor that is getting rave reviews in Sony's own A580 and A55, the Pentax K-5, the Nikon D7000 and now the Nikon D5100.

    The more interesting question for me is what lens Sony intend to package with this camera that will do justice to all those pixels. The current kit lenses have often been unfairly criticised - usually by people who seem to expect premium performance from what is a budget lens. On the basis of my own experience with the 18-55 kit lens I think that it is a very acceptable lens for what it is. But even its greatest advocates would have to accept that there is no way that it is capable of doing justice to the resolution available with a 24MP sensor. It's interesting to note that according to SAR there will be a new high quality kit zoom lens for the 'A77'.

    So, if the 'NEX-7' is indeed announced in July and does start shipping in September, what are we going to be putting on the front of it? Sony's E-Mount lens roadmap does allow for a high quality 'G' branded standard zoom, just the thing to match with this camera, but it is not scheduled to appear until 2012.

    Either, Sony are going to introduce this lens a lot sooner than anticipated - and wouldn't we all love that - or Sony isn't going to introduce the 'NEX-7' anytime soon and will release the camera and lens together at some point in 2012 - groans of disappointment all round.

    There is one other intriguing possibility though. Since the 24mm Sony Carl Zeiss prime is scheduled to appear this year, could it be that Sony will market the 'NEX-7' with this as the kit lens? This might go some way to explaining that rumoured $1300 price tag. In some respects this could be Sony's high-tech version of the Fuji X100. Yes, the Sony would have interchangeable lenses, but a high-end NEX with a fast Carl Zeiss prime sounds like a winner to me even if we would once again have to wait for further suitable lenses to appear.

    I don't know about you, but I am as intrigued by this possibility as many of our members have been by the X100. Having determined that I would never spend more than $1000 on a camera I find my resolution potentially wavering. If the 'NEX-7' has a 24MP sensor and if that sensor can build on the image quality of Sony's existing best sensor and if it comes with the Zeiss 24mm as standard and if that lens lives up to its name, then I could very easily be tempted.

    That's a lot of 'ifs', I know, but ultimately it's all speculation and rumour, just a bit of fun for now. Only time, and Sony, will tell.
     
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  2. soundimageplus

    soundimageplus SC Top Veteran

    578
    Jul 6, 2010
    Rumours are just that - Rumours. However this one about the 24MP APS-C sensor is strong and persistent. Plus Sony have gone to some trouble to indicate that they are pulling out all the stops for the ?A77. The fact that it hasn't appeared as yet is perhaps a sign of just how difficult what they are trying to do is, since Sony don't seem to be shy about getting cameras on the shelves.

    If some of their "nods and winks" are true they are attempting a 24MP APS-C sensor with high ISO going into the "hundreds of thousands" So basically the performance of a Nikon D3S with twice the pixels and half the size!! As Olli indicated their 16MP Exmor sensor is indeed excellent, but this is quite a significant step on from that. To then contemplate putting that sensor into a NEX camera, is either fantasy land or the first step to the global camera market domination which Sony seem to crave.

    I have a Sony a850 full-frame camera which has a 24MP sensor. Just to give some idea of what this produces, its a 20" x 14" at 300ppi, 70MB file. So about 25% bigger than A2. The files are indeed massive. The quality is very impressive and the high ISO is usable up to ISO 3200. The idea of Sony attempting to significantly improve on this with an APS-C sensor is indeed ambitious, and if genuine and sucessful, will probably be the biggest ever single quality jump in the short history of digital photography. While most of us assumed that something like this would arrive eventually, I doubt many of us thought it would be this soon.

    Olli makes good points about lenses to do this justice, and certainly the thought of Carl Zeiss primes is mouth-watering, though just how big a 24mm f/1.7 would be on a NEX is anybodies guess. "Do you have a camera behind that lens?"

    There will of course be the usual "You don't need 24MP" comments, but there always are. I read some "You only need 6MP" comments just the other day. Just what kind of arrogance gives one photographer the right to tell other photographers what they "need" or "don't need" escapes me, but I'll skip over that.

    As far as I'm concerned a couple of decent primes would be all I would need. With my a850 I only have a 28-75mm f/2.8 zoom. Since I mainly use the camera for landscape this serves most of my needs. I stitch multi-images together for a wider view and crop for a longer view. To be honest I couldn't carry another longer lens as its heavy enough as it is. The thought of being able to get that resolution on a camera the size of a NEX is very exciting, and since I would be using it at base ISO mostly, I'm not personally that bothered about low light performance, though it would obviously be great if they could get that to work well.

    I've no doubt that Sony are trying to get this to work, indeed I would imagine that all the sensor manufacturers are doing the same. How close any of them are is anybodies guess. My hope is that they will succeed, and despite my reservations about its design, if a 24MP NEX is announced, I'm on the phone with my credit card to place a deposit. I suspect I won't be alone.
     
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  3. olli

    olli Super Moderator Emeritus

    Sep 28, 2010
    Metro Manila
    olli
    index_img_03.

    This is the official Sony image of the current and planned E-Mount lenses. You can see the Zeiss 24 on the left hand side in black with the distinctive blue Zeiss logo. The 18-55 kit lens is the one on the far right. If accurate this suggests that the 24 will be broadly comparable in size, though presumably heavier with that extra glass, to the 18-55.
     
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  4. soundimageplus

    soundimageplus SC Top Veteran

    578
    Jul 6, 2010
    Now I'll never be able to resist it!!
     
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  5. Streetshooter

    Streetshooter Administrator Emeritus

    Jul 12, 2010
    Philly, Pa
    I gotta tell ya, the Nex turns me on like no other camera.
    I don't think there's just one reason but many.
    If we get a 24mp Nex7 with the Zeiss 24 1.7.
    Well, worlds will collide, the space time continuum will change.
    Is is really possible? Will it really be a reality?
    I for one hope so. In fact I'll be with David & Olli at the camera store....
     
  6. Amin Sabet

    Amin Sabet Administrator

    Jul 3, 2010
    Not to be a downer, but I will eat my socks if this happens within the next year. There has never been a jump in sensor technology that dramatic in the history of digital photography.
     
  7. Andrewteee

    Andrewteee SC All-Pro

    Jul 8, 2010
    Makes me wonder if Sony is going after the pro market with such a camera. How many consumers need 24 megapixels (sorry soundimageplus)? That would create huge files that would quickly and unnecessarily fill up their hard drives.

    But, we'll see how these rumors pan out. I would hope that a few more of those lenses pictured above are released along with the NEX 7.
     
  8. Streetshooter

    Streetshooter Administrator Emeritus

    Jul 12, 2010
    Philly, Pa
    Amin, hopefully you won't need salt & pepper with those socks.
    I think if this will happen, Sony is the one to do it.
    I think this has been in the works with them for some time.
    Sony is more quiet than most and I hope it happens soon.
    I have hot sause if you need it.
     
  9. soundimageplus

    soundimageplus SC Top Veteran

    578
    Jul 6, 2010
    One thing I've always liked about Sony is they seem willing to take a chance. They come up with great technology that doesn't necessarily end up as they would wish and get mass acceptance. Betamax and DAT are good examples, but both found their niche in the professional world.

    I'm with both you and Don on this. Yes its a big jump and seems unlikely, but if anyone can do it they can. Their 16MP Exmor was a real breakthrough. I used the Canon 18MP and it was OK but the Exmor is just so much cleaner, and has terrific dynamic range. I know it doesn't work quite this way but if Panasonic can get a workable 18MP sensor (because 18MP is how its populated) for a m4/3 sensor then 24MP for APS-C isn't much more of a jump. Their claim of ISO's into the hundreds of thousands is the difficult bit. as I'm assuming that they probably want the images to be recognisable.

    Another thing I like about Sony is that they do seem interested in what their customers think. At the recent Focus on Imaging show, both myself and my nephew, who works mainly in video, were interviewed at length by Sony reps, as to what we used, why we used what we did and what we thought of Sony products and what we would like to see. This was done anonymously, they didn't want email adresses or details or names. Our responses were recorded in full, not just tick boxes and the people who interviewed us knew what they were talking about.

    PR exercise - maybe, but I've never experienced anything like that before. The interesting thing is that they were targeting "serious" photographers, i.e. enthusiasts and professionals. It may be nothing and its obviously just one persons anecdotal observation, but I do get the impression that Sony are interested in all areas of the market. As I said it may be PR but if it was it worked with me. Its the closest I've ever come to talking to a company directly to say what my experiences were and what I would like to see, and for what its worth I appreciated that.
     
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  10. Streetshooter

    Streetshooter Administrator Emeritus

    Jul 12, 2010
    Philly, Pa
    David, that's great about the interview. It shows concern for users.

    I remember when the Nex was announced. I thought, what a stupid design. It's ugly and I would never buy it. After a spell of looking at images, reading reviews and user reports, I still felt it to be ugly and stupid.
    Then, my daughter bought a Nex 5. I played with it and all the sudden, it wasn't such a stupid camera. I ended getting one and really enjoy it.
    It's still an ugly sucker but it makes beautiful images.

    So, I learned that Sony is very daring and adventurous.
    They are leaders and break ground when they want to.
    There is no doubt in my mind that Sony is the wave to ride into the future.

    By the way, I'll do a video with the Nex7 of Amin eating his socks...
    Around here, it'll be a best seller.
     
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  11. soundimageplus

    soundimageplus SC Top Veteran

    578
    Jul 6, 2010
    Its not just me who thinks that then!!
     
  12. olli

    olli Super Moderator Emeritus

    Sep 28, 2010
    Metro Manila
    olli
    I quite like the way it looks. Or it could be that I'm just taken with the first silver camera I've owned in many years.
     
  13. Pelao

    Pelao SC All-Pro

    Jul 11, 2010
    Ontario, Canada
    Stephen
    Count me in on the ugly vote.

    I am not such a big Sony fan. They do indeed develop breakthrough ideas, but often fall over at the final hurdle, at least for me. I do await the Nex 7 with interest though.
     
  14. Djarum

    Djarum SC All-Pro

    Jul 10, 2010
    Huntsville, AL
    Jason
    Yes it is ugly. I think i'd be more interested if it had a few more dials and they come out with a collapsable kit lens. The ergonomics are ok, but I think I like the E-pl2 ergonomics better. I do love that lcd screen.
     
  15. olli

    olli Super Moderator Emeritus

    Sep 28, 2010
    Metro Manila
    olli
    I'll take a couple more programmable buttons but no dials for me. That would be a seriously backward step.
     
  16. Streetshooter

    Streetshooter Administrator Emeritus

    Jul 12, 2010
    Philly, Pa
    olli, I completely agree. Truth be told, if there was a real good menu design, I could dig a touch screen. Just think, access everything on a screen...
    Yeah baby, that's what I'm talking about.
    We doin need no stupid dials on the Nex 7.
     
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  17. Janis

    Janis SC Regular

    145
    Nov 22, 2010
    Central Texas
    Ahem! My silver NEX5 is NOT ugly!
     
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  18. Streetshooter

    Streetshooter Administrator Emeritus

    Jul 12, 2010
    Philly, Pa
    Janis,
    It's a guy thing, you wouldn't understand...:smile:
     
  19. olli

    olli Super Moderator Emeritus

    Sep 28, 2010
    Metro Manila
    olli
    Don I won't take offence at your implication that I'm not one of the guys. Janis, I'm in your corner.
     
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  20. Janis

    Janis SC Regular

    145
    Nov 22, 2010
    Central Texas
    It's funny because I've seen it criticized for sacrificing buttons and controls just to be stylish. I guess few things are more subjective than beauty and style. It's extremely sleek and modern, that's for sure, but I like it in spite of the fact that I also love the retro rangefinder look. The real beauty part with the NEX is the image quality!
     
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