Ricoh Ricoh GRDV to Feature an APS-C Sensor!

[wt21]

I do however think that the audience for the Sony RX100 is different than that for the Ricoh GRD. The RX100 is a consumer camera meant to appeal to people who want something better than their phone camera but not as big as a DSLR. Ricoh GRD is directed more towards experienced photographers who are looking for a capable compact that can be customized and designed the way they want and operates using the same nomenclature as a DSLR.

I would be more interested in a GRDV with a 1" sensor over an APS-C, if Ricoh could keep the body size down and the lens bright. But, given that I already have the RX100 with a pretty capable zoom, I'm not sure I could justify a single FL camera, so perhaps I'm not even in the GRDV target market. (just speaking through my own thought process. I don't think I'm knowledgeable enough to speak about entire market segments' needs).

 

[Ripleysbaby]

hmmm...

My first thought was "great!" but the more I think about it, the GRDs filled quite a niche. How can you do snap focus with such a larger sensor. Zone focusing was easy with the compact sensor. Is it going to be 28mm eq? This FL is a bit crowded with some quality ASP-C offerings. Unless they make it super-bright. I'm trying to think about what would make you want a likely larger GRDV at 28mm over any of the other contenders.

I have had a lot of success using snap on my gxr (with 50mm down) and a smaller stop . So i think it would still be a usable feature.

 

[Paul Giguere]

hmmm...

My first thought was "great!" but the more I think about it, the GRDs filled quite a niche. How can you do snap focus with such a larger sensor. Zone focusing was easy with the compact sensor. Is it going to be 28mm eq? This FL is a bit crowded with some quality ASP-C offerings. Unless they make it super-bright. I'm trying to think about what would make you want a likely larger GRDV at 28mm over any of the other contenders.

Yes, these are all unanswered questions and we probably won't know until just before the announcement when the specs are "ahem" leaked. I would imagine that the snap focus on a GRDV would work pretty much the same it did on the GXR 28mm lens module in that you did get shallower depth of field unless you closed down the aperture. It took a but more thought but in practice I didn't find it to be a problem and I got great shots using snap on the GXR.

I do agree that the lens will have to be spectacular (I'm thinking f1.4 would be just about right but I'm not sure of the physics of the thing). Even if they get it to about f1.8 or so, the lens will still have to be larger than the current GRD lens due to the sensor. The bottom line is hold on to your current GRD camera. I think the GRDV will be different enough from prior models that I can see there being a place for both cameras (if you are so inclined).

Paul

 

[Paul Giguere]

I would be more interested in a GRDV with a 1" sensor over an APS-C, if Ricoh could keep the body size down and the lens bright. But, given that I already have the RX100 with a pretty capable zoom, I'm not sure I could justify a single FL camera, so perhaps I'm not even in the GRDV target market. (just speaking through my own thought process. I don't think I'm knowledgeable enough to speak about entire market segments' needs).

It's funny but I'm not sure where the GRDV would fit for me either. I have a spectrum of capabilities already covered (GRD4, Sony RX1, and Pentax K-5). Clearly the GRD5 would be destined to replace the GRD4 but I'm not so sure that would be the case given that the GRD4 is significantly different from the other two cameras that I own. A GRD5 and the RX1 (while very different in their own right) might be too close on the spectrum. Anyway, it's all bellybutton gazing right now. I look forward to seeing what Ricoh has done with the GRD5 and if it is the right camera for me, I'll get one otherwise, I'll simply be happy with what I already have

Paul

 

[Prototype]

hmmm...

My first thought was "great!" but the more I think about it, the GRDs filled quite a niche. How can you do snap focus with such a larger sensor. Zone focusing was easy with the compact sensor. Is it going to be 28mm eq? This FL is a bit crowded with some quality ASP-C offerings. Unless they make it super-bright. I'm trying to think about what would make you want a likely larger GRDV at 28mm over any of the other contenders.

Going by my experience, zone focusing was not an issue with the Sigma DP1 and its 16.6mm lens. If this camera has a 1.5x crop sensor and 19mm lens, zone focusing should not be an issue either. Besides, they found a way to zone focus back when "full frame" was the standard for consumers

As for a reason to choose a GRD over the competition, I think it will be similar as to why consumers chose the previous GRD's: A quality prime fixed lens and intuitive controls. I don't expect the lens to be super bright since they probably want to make it small. My guess is a 19mm f/2.8.

 

[Paul Giguere]

Going by my experience, zone focusing was not an issue with the Sigma DP1 and its 16.6mm lens. If this camera has a 1.5x crop sensor and 19mm lens, zone focusing should not be an issue either. Besides, they found a way to zone focus back when "full frame" was the standard for consumers

As for a reason to choose a GRD over the competition, I think it will be similar as to why consumers chose the previous GRD's: A quality prime fixed lens and intuitive controls. I don't expect the lens to be super bright since they probably want to make it small. My guess is a 19mm f/2.8.

I hadn't thought of that but I think you may be right, the GRD5 may have to use a slower lens if Ricoh is going to maintain the same equivalent focal length (28mm) and still keep the lens small enough to work in a compact body. This would put the Ricoh in competition with cameras like the Sigma DPX and Leica X2 (to name a couple). The GRD5 may not be enough to win over new converts (who knows for sure) but perhaps Ricoh is also looking to bring along those who are already Ricoh fans (there are many of them in Japan, China and other parts of Asia).

Paul

 

[Ray Sachs]

hmmm...

My first thought was "great!" but the more I think about it, the GRDs filled quite a niche. How can you do snap focus with such a larger sensor. Zone focusing was easy with the compact sensor. Is it going to be 28mm eq? This FL is a bit crowded with some quality ASP-C offerings. Unless they make it super-bright. I'm trying to think about what would make you want a likely larger GRDV at 28mm over any of the other contenders.

I never had any problems snap focussing with the GXR with the 28mm equivalent. Yeah, there's less DOF for any given aperture, so you need a smaller one, but with a sensor that's very good up to 3200, that was rarely a problem. When I got my X-Pro, I sold the GXR and kept the GRD just to have some version of the Ricoh interface available. But the sensor in the GRD3 came to frustrate me compared to any of my other cameras, so I sold that and just bought back a used GXR 28 - I should have kept the GXR in the first place. The X-Pro is a bit better in low light, but its a very different interface and there's room in my quiver for both and I'll use both. If the new GRD has a better APS sensor, is still 28mm, maintains its great interface, is still in the f2.0 neighborhood, and is similarly compact to the old GRD models, MAYBE I'll end up buying that eventually. But I paid a lot less for the GXR 28 than I'd have to pay for a new GRD with the configuration we're discussing and and the GXR is a bird in the hand. Time will tell how tasty that bird in the bush will be. Hard to imagine it'll be better than the GXR 28 without making compromises either in terms of lens speed or size. The sensor may be better at high ISO, but 3200 at f2.5 gives me plenty of latitude...

-Ray

 

[Andrewteee]

I hadn't thought of that but I think you may be right, the GRD5 may have to use a slower lens if Ricoh is going to maintain the same equivalent focal length (28mm) and still keep the lens small enough to work in a compact body. This would put the Ricoh in competition with cameras like the Sigma DPX and Leica X2 (to name a couple). The GRD5 may not be enough to win over new converts (who knows for sure) but perhaps Ricoh is also looking to bring along those who are already Ricoh fans (there are many of them in Japan, China and other parts of Asia).

The GR was f2.8 for a long time. From a marketing perspective it's a hard to sell if they had to decrease the aperture, but as a current GRD shooter I'm fine with it. f2 would be ideal, f2.8 is fine if necessary. But of course the GXR 28mm already uses an f2.5 aperture. That may provide some indication. I agree that it may not win over too many new converts, but for the many Ricoh fans it would be a boon. A small but perhaps large enough market for Ricoh and the GRD. In truth, how many current GRD shooters would upgrade from the IV to the V if it essentially remained the same.

I know this is all conjecture and rumor... but it's probably time for the GRD to grow up a little bit in sensor size. The landscape has changed. Many will lament the loss of the small sensor, but in truth there are still many small sensor options if they are not exactly Ricoh. The Fuji X20 sounds like it may be pretty capable. An option is for Ricoh to offer both a GRD "A16" and a GRD "S10". Make everyone happy

 

[Isoterica]

I wonder if having a new sensor/lens will render the same film-like quality you can get with a GRD. I know that this is software processing the information captured but I would think that software would have to evolve around the new hardware. I like that what comes out of camera particularly at higher iso has that film realistic grain to it rather than the noise you can get with other cameras. If they could pull that off with an APC-C... I'm already used to shooting that with my Canon so I would be quite comfortable with it.

 

[Luckypenguin]

Call me strange, but I think I would prefer to see this with the old 12MP APS-C sensor used in the A12 GXRs than the latest 16MP Sony Exmor.