Trying to make a decision is too difficult

Discussion in 'Sony E-Mount (incl. NEX, A7, A7R, A3000) Forum' started by NkedFatWhiteGuy, Aug 1, 2014.

  1. NkedFatWhiteGuy

    NkedFatWhiteGuy SC Rookie

    24
    Oct 29, 2013
    So this is either going to get completely ignored or it will be pounced on by many with lots of input! I am posting this on the Serious Compacts forum to see if I can get both sides instead of input from just one group of mirrorless users.

    To make a long story super short, I have become incredibly frustrated with the way that Sony does business and am trying to decide if I should "jump ship" and swim over to the Fuji boat. I have been notified by my local camera shop that they can get me either the X-T1 or the X-E2 and that they will allow me to return my a6000 for credit and receive credit for the Zeiss 16-70 that I paid for a couple of months ago and have yet to receive. They let me know that they can get me into a Fuji in about a week and they also just told me the Zeiss E-Mount will be arriving in about a week. I think this is just to make my decission more difficult ;-)

    If I make the move to Fuji, I will sell all of my E-Mount lenses (16-50 PZ, 50 1.8, 55-210, 16 2.8, and 20 2.8), my flash adapter, LA-EA2, my NEX 6, all of my MF lens adapters (Minolta, Canon, Tamron, Rollei), 2 Sony flashes, and all of my old A - Mount lenses I still have. If I do this, it will be to get rid of all of my Sony photo gear and probably even some of my older Minolta Maxxum gear too. I will even need "Sony Fan Boy" tattoo removal (j/k).

    Why Fuji when I have a decent investment in Sony? Well, it started when I recieved my first SLVR as a gift. That camera was a Fujica AX-5 and I still have it in full shooting condition. I then purchased an X20 last March and have become completely enamored with it; it is one of the only "no regrets" camera purchases I have ever made. Given that, I have only handled the X-E2 once in a shop, and have never touched an X-T1. If I were to go the Fuji route, I would probably focus on just the XF zooms and maybe a single fast prime to augment MY lenses iso already have.

    If I go fuji, I will lose a fairly sizeable investment and will be forced to buy a good deal of "net new".

    I do not have any issues with the a6000, but I have not really spent enough time with it to get to know it better. I have been so upset with Sony as a company (digital camera sales, too rapid of a refresh/obsolescence cycle for their cameras, and lack of long term support and firmware updates) that I have not yet given the a6000 a fair chance...

    My primary shooting will be family (4 year-old boy and Anda new little one arriving around December/January holiday season), some street, some travel, and a lot of just general shooting. I am a definite hobbiest/enthusiast without any real aspirations of becoming more than that (at least that is what I tell myself when I am at work and when I am talking to my wife!). I do want to do some video, but there again, nothing more than capturing family moments. I do end up shooting a lot in lower light and with faster moving subjects.

    Anyway, I have been rambling and am really look to ask for you input and your thoughts.

    What do you think?
     
  2. pdh

    pdh SC Legend

    Jan 2, 2011
    Go into shop.
    Pick up camera.
    Do you want to put camera down?
    No? - buy camera
    Yes? - don't buy camera
     
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  3. Isoterica

    Isoterica SC Hall of Famer

    Dec 6, 2011
    What Paul said probably seems vague or even trite but he has it right. If you aren't feeling it with the Sony, whatever your reasons, then it's probably time to part with it though you do have a good investment in the system. Make sure that you want to offload it first. As to a replacement, you should feel excited about the new camera in your hands, about the prospect of using it, and not want to put it down for it to be the right replacement. If your overall mood doesn't change from handling one camera to the next, chances are it isn't the camera, or the company. Fuji makes new cameras every year too. They seem good with keeping firmware updated-- so far. People say their service is good. But the camera has to feel right to you otherwise you will regret the sacrifice of change, and you will be getting rid of a lot of gear. Money left over after? Invest it in vacations, places to use your new gear. Good luck with whatever you choose :)
     
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  4. pdh

    pdh SC Legend

    Jan 2, 2011
    Well I thought I was being as clear and to the point as possible. Life's too short to spend hours hashing over this sort of thing.
     
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  5. NkedFatWhiteGuy

    NkedFatWhiteGuy SC Rookie

    24
    Oct 29, 2013
    Life is way too short for this!!!

    I did go back and forth between the X-E1, the NEX 6, and an A77 because they all felt good (I completely agree with with the feel and desire to use being the most important aspect in buying buying a camera! Some of my favorite images are from a Sony DSC-290W because I liked to shoot it not because of the tech in the camera) but ended up not going with the A77 because of size and lack of lens adaptability. I had a touch time deciding between the NEX and the Fuji, but figured I could get use out of my existing gear staying with Sony.

    I started experiencing focus point issues with the 6 (seem to be all resolved now with a factory reset and the last firmware) so went to move to the a6000 so I could leverage my investments and take advantage of the $300 off of the body with the Zeiss 16-70. I think if I had been able to get the body and lens right away - or at least together - I wouldn't wouldn't be having this conversation and would just be wondering "what if" on the Fujis while shooting away.
     
  6. NathanCom

    NathanCom SC Regular

    30
    May 15, 2014
    it is only a few hundred pounds so not a huge amount of money in the scheme of things. Photos from Fuji X series look fantastic and the cameras look great to me from ergonomics side and appearance so I know where my vote would sit.
     
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  7. qhs232

    qhs232 SC Regular

    196
    Oct 6, 2013
    Metro Detroit
    Gary
    I currently have both an A6000/50 1.8, and the XE-2 with the 35 1.4 and the excellent kit 18-55. If I could get a decent return on the A6000, 50 1.8 combo, I would probably sell it, only because I don't want to have two camera systems, not because I dislike it.

    There are things about both cameras that I like, but at the end of the day I feel more at home and happy with the image quality with the Fuji, and its as simple as that.

    If you are also going to use the camera for video, then the A6000, especially with one of the stabilized primes is probably your best option.

    I do not have any experience with trying to lock focus on moving children, so I can't help there.

    I use the Ricoh GR as my wide-angle lens and when paired with the Fuji 35mm....I'm a happy camper.
     
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  8. john m flores

    john m flores SC All-Pro

    Aug 13, 2012
    If you've got small children, particularly those involved in youth sports or just being generally photogenically cute as they boomerang about the house, they'll present an AF.C challenge for most mirrorless cameras. Fuji's AF has always been "gentlemanly", and there was a lot of buzz about the improved AF of the XT-1, but now that the hype has worn thin most of what I read is that while it is improved, it's still not on par with the best of the category. AFAIK, your Sony is highly rated, as are the Nikon 1 series and the Panasonic GH4.

    I can understand some of your frustrations with Sony, but keep your priorities straight–you appear to want a smallish camera that can take good photos of rambunctious children. And for that, the A6000 appears to be one of the best. So look carefully before you leap, because this leap on principle may result in blurry photos.
     
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  9. Luke

    Luke Super Moderator

    Nov 11, 2011
    Milwaukee, WI USA
    Luke
    when I am struck by the ailment of paralysis from over-analysis, I find it's often best just to push away from the table.

    The camera you have is a very capable one and you have a bunch of nice lenses. Forget about comparing everything and enjoy what you have. Take the money you would lose on selling your current kit and buying a FUji kit and take the family somewhere nice for a vacation. And don't look at any camera forums while you're away. You'll come back with a TON of great photos and a lifetime of memories (and possibly a sunburn)
     
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  10. Ray Sachs

    Ray Sachs SC Legend

    Sep 21, 2010
    Not too far from Philly
    you should be able to figure it out...
    I'd say Sony's biggest weakness (in the APS version of their E-Mouint bodies anyway) is their ability to roll out a full compliment of lenses. But their bodies are quite good (if you're OK with their unique controls) and their QC is quite good. So if you're happy with your lens lineup with your Sony gear, I'd sit tight. For my money, Fuji has the upper hand with lenses, particularly their primes, which are almost uniformly excellent. Their bodies have controls I'm pretty familiar with, but their X-Trans sensor has worn somewhat thin on me. It's not the low light beast some would have you believe - similar to the other current APS sensors really, and a lot of people jump through all sorts of hoops to find a processor they're happy with doing raw conversions from the current line of Fujis. I've also gotta report way too many Fuji QC issues lately. They've actually been happening going back to the X100, but I only recently got bit by them. I had an XT1 I had to send in twice for repairs of common problems and the finally had to replace it. And then I sold all of my Fuji gear not long ago and I actually got complaints - first time I've EVER had complaints about stuff I've sold, about lenses not working with bodies and sub-standard lenses. They all got resolved but it was not fun to deal with. As nice as Fuji's gear is when you get a good copy, there are too many issues with their gear for me to really feel comfortable with it lately.

    That said, if you just LIKE the Fuji stuff, you can probably work around any issues that you might have, and you might get lucky and have none. But I don't think I'd switch just because Sony changes gear so often - nearly everyone is doing that these days. Shouldn't stop you from getting and keeping stuff you like...

    -Ray
     
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  11. Crsnydertx

    Crsnydertx SC Top Veteran

    758
    Jan 21, 2011
    Houston, TX
    Chuck
    Ray, for what it's worth: the used X-E2 you sold me is superb! :biggrin:
     
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  12. Ray Sachs

    Ray Sachs SC Legend

    Sep 21, 2010
    Not too far from Philly
    you should be able to figure it out...
    I'm glad of that! The replaced XT1 I sold was fine too, but a couple of lenses had problems that hadn't shown up on the bodies I'd used them on... I felt bad about selling defective stuff, even if unintentionally...

    -Ray
     
  13. demiro

    demiro Serious Compacts For Life

    527
    Dec 15, 2011
    I don't have any wisdom on what choice to make, just a reminder that whatever choice you make is not final. Not in any way. So, don't sweat it too much. I know, you lose money if you change systems over and over again, but I think you have to consider that a reasonable fee for the lack of ability to make a choice and stick with it. That's what I tell myself anyway.

    As for the choice at hand, I've tried to make nice with NEX a couple of times, and I believe the IQ is there if you shoot raw and post process a bit, but ultimately I've gone away from them because (1) I'd rather shoot nice JPEGs and (2) the lenses just aren't to my liking. But you have to decide based on your criteria, obviously. I'd recommend giving more weight to the camera and how you interact with it and less to your feelings about the company.
     
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  14. Luckypenguin

    Luckypenguin SC Hall of Famer

    Dec 24, 2010
    Brisbane, Australia
    Nic
    Among the pre-eminent mirrorless sytems I don't think that there is a single one that isn't extremely capable, be it Sony, Fujifilm, Samsung, or Micro 4/3. Each has evolved along slightly differently lines however so you'll need to choose what you value most. Do you really need to do an immediate cleanout of one system for the other, or can you dip your toes in the Fuji waters with something like a second-hand X-E1 and 18-55mm to see how you like it?
     
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  15. pniev

    pniev Student for life

    Jun 10, 2013
    One of the good thing about this forum is that it's a "whatever suits your needs" forum when it comes to gear selection. Nic already said that most systems deliver fantastic results. And Paul summarized it by saying"follow your heart". And like Ray, I do believe that any company ou there has service issues. My advice would be: collect the facts, sleep on it, and listen to your inner voice.

    I am not familiar with the sonys but I am happy with the X-T1. It is fast enough for photographing moving objects and I like the IQ. The older systems are slower. A thing I really like about Fuji as well is their commitment to improving functionality via firmware upgrades.

    Does your AD allow you to use the system for a week or so to test it?
     
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  16. Crsnydertx

    Crsnydertx SC Top Veteran

    758
    Jan 21, 2011
    Houston, TX
    Chuck
    I assume the folks to whom you sold the lenses had upgraded their cameras' firmware...? I'm pretty careful about staying current, although I haven't installed the latest version that reportedly supports the 18-135 lens (no interest). Waiting for the rumored big upgrade this fall.
     
  17. Ray Sachs

    Ray Sachs SC Legend

    Sep 21, 2010
    Not too far from Philly
    you should be able to figure it out...
    Oh yeah, we'd been through ALL of the possibilities, including a few telephone calls with Fuji USA. Ultimately I was told that some lenses (mounts, mostly) are off by just enough in one particular direction to work with most cameras but not others, while other's are off in the other direction and will work and not work with different subsets of cameras. And some cameras have lens mounts that are slightly off in one direction or another too, so there are enough variables to make trouble-shooting difficult. Ultimately, one of the guys had to send his camera body back to them ALONG WITH the lens to determine which was faulty. He told me it turned out it was the lens and Fuji fixed it while there to his satisfaction. But it had always worked perfectly on both of the bodies I'd used it on. The Fuji tech guy thought, based on the evidence, that it was probably a problem with his camera rather than the lens, but it turned out to be the lens.

    Anyway, I probably sounded too harsh on Fuji above. Obviously they make really nice stuff. I absolutely LOVE several of their prime lenses. MANY of the best photographs I've taken (my favorites anyway) have been taken with Fuji cameras and lenses. I like the bodies well enough and the X-Trans sensors are a matter of taste - some love 'em, some hate 'em. I like them well enough but don't buy the overheated claims about them. I also like them more for jpegs than for raw, but I shoot raw. If they removed the X-Trans array or if I was dedicated enough to change my workflow to Photo Ninja or Irident Developer, I might feel differently. The odds just finally caught up with me I guess. I had one of the early X100 copies that did NOT have sticky aperture blade problems. I did get bitten by the X-10 orb problem, but so did everyone else who bought one before they re-did the sensor. I'd never had a problem with a camera or lens before. But with the XT1, I had ALL of the problems some of the early copies of that camera had, causing sending it back to Fuji USA twice and ultimately having it replaced. And I evidently had a couple of new problem lenses too. I never had a speck of trouble with that XE2 I sold to you though! :cool: I know all makers have their share of issues - I'm shooting Nikon now and they've certainly had their share in the recent years.

    Bottom line - if the OP likes the Fuji stuff, the QC probelms might not affect him at all and can certainly be worked around if they do. Fuji's service is great and their firmware update history is extremely admirable. As noted, their prime lenses are as good as any in the mirrorless world. I'm not recommending that anyone not buy Fuji gear if that's what they want. But, as with any other manufacturer, they have their issues too. There's no perfect make of cameras out there...

    -Ray
     
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  18. zx7dave

    zx7dave New to SC

    6
    Jul 25, 2014
    Honolulu
    If you are shooting low light, stay with the Sony...I have been down the Fuji road before and while their pictures look great at low ISO, they are just the opposite at higher ISO. a6000 is a really awesome camera...I do agree that Sony as a company for support, and update really stink. Having been a long time Nikon and Sony guy I have learned to look past most of that and realize they do make really nice sensors which is the heart of your camera....
     
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  19. NkedFatWhiteGuy

    NkedFatWhiteGuy SC Rookie

    24
    Oct 29, 2013
    Luke - This is what I need to do... I do this way too often. I have always over analyzed larger purchases and often have buyer's remorse because I feel like I made the wrong decision. Forums have been the cause of a lot of this, but I find so much other great value from them I can't not read them. I just need not pay attention to the "this gear is better than your gear" portions of the discussions. ;-)
     
  20. Luke

    Luke Super Moderator

    Nov 11, 2011
    Milwaukee, WI USA
    Luke
    I'm as guilty of this as the next guy (or more). I am trying to remind myself more often that none of my camera purchases has ever resulted in me becoming a better photographer.
     
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